[Raapi]

Quite a humerous take on the status of many ethnic European Muslims in the Balkans (not immigrant ones.)

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=7WP5XPRk5wg

[Bright One]

Quite strange... for want of a better word. Obscure, maybe. But I guess it does highlight various issues that Balkans Muslims face... thery're naturalised in that part of Europe, been there since the sixteenth century or so, but there's deep-set divisions between them and their Slavic Christian neighbours.

[Raapi]

Yes, unfortunately the circulating attitude of that whole regions national group 'representatives' is eye for an eye tooth for a tooth...

But I liked how the video made it kind of funny, also it subtely highlights some of the drawbacks many Muslims feel their default religion bestows on them: namely seriousness - many are slightly envious of how Christianity has been greatly liberalised and is powerless to respond to that. Islam is mostly still a dominant force in most od the Muslim world and therefore can keep a hold of it's more strict forms. That's why I'm proud of Turkey, people really question their default religious background and Turkey is rapidly becoming arguably as 'Muslim' as western Europe is 'Christian'.

[Bright One]

Raapi said:

Yes, unfortunately the circulating attitude of that whole regions national group 'representatives' is eye for an eye tooth for a tooth...

Often the case in conflicts between varying factions inside a country, ethnic, political, religious etc. etc. a bit like the conflict between Protestants and Catholics in Northern Ireland, very eye for an eye a tooth for a tooth.

Raapi said:

But I liked how the video made it kind of funny, also it subtely highlights some of the drawbacks many Muslims feel their default religion bestows on them: namely seriousness - many are slightly envious of how Christianity has been greatly liberalised and is powerless to respond to that.

I got that impression to, at times he seemed to resent the restrictions Islam placed on him. It might have something to do with how religion can be a fundamental part of tradition, of culture... and that's how so many people come to follow that religion - it's a way of life, a set of rules for a worldly existence rather than a spiritual path.

Raapi said:

Islam is mostly still a dominant force in most od the Muslim world and therefore can keep a hold of it's more strict forms. That's why I'm proud of Turkey, people really question their default religious background and Turkey is rapidly becoming arguably as 'Muslim' as western Europe is 'Christian'.

I've heard that in Turkey, although most people could be considered Muslim, there's no official state religion. I agree, I live in the UK where Anglican Christianity is the official state religion but, although it was important in the past, it doesn't tend to influence the society we live in... moreso the society we live in influences it. And a lot of the Catholic countires, well they don't base their laws on what the Vatican says and they tend to have a very relaxed attitude towards sex.

[Raapi]

Bright One, on Oct 1 2006, 12:41 AM, said:

Often the case in conflicts between varying factions inside a country, ethnic, political, religious etc. etc. a bit like the conflict between Protestants and Catholics in Northern Ireland, very eye for an eye a tooth for a tooth.

Yep, I often equate many global conflicts to the Northern Ireland thing specifically because it is a great example of how to achieve reconciliation...: Dialogue. N.I. is fairly peaceful as far as I know now and that only came about when both sides managed to agree on a mututal base of dialogue. Again, on a local level I equate our Kurdish problem to N.I.

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I got that impression to, at times he seemed to resent the restrictions Islam placed on him. It might have something to do with how religion can be a fundamental part of tradition, of culture... and that's how so many people come to follow that religion - it's a way of life, a set of rules for a worldly existence rather than a spiritual path.

What I underlined is key - I only happily tolerate more dogmatic religions when they have a secondary role in society; when they're in the background keeping their noses out of politics and such and do not play a primal role in people's lives. IMO Western Europe has achieved that very well (some fanatic Christian groups call for it's re-Christianisation) as well as Japan and Turkey and other key places like Kazakhstan etc are well on their way.

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I've heard that in Turkey, although most people could be considered Muslim, there's no official state religion. I agree, I live in the UK where Anglican Christianity is the official state religion but, although it was important in the past, it doesn't tend to influence the society we live in... moreso the society we live in influences it. And a lot of the Catholic countires, well they don't base their laws on what the Vatican says and they tend to have a very relaxed attitude towards sex.

Yes, 99% Muslim as Italy is 99% Catholic hehe.. that said we still are a more conservative society with religion still playing a key role in many peoples lives even if they do not properly adhere to it. I lived in the UK for 9 years and I can say that it is still more socially secular than Turkey even though our government is arguably more secular than the UK's..!