My wiccan friends and I were dicussing about a "Guardian", like when you AP, you try to enter in other's people dream or mind, then, they told me about guardians that keep a magic person's mind, if they really exist, is it dangerous to enter in that magical's person mind\dream ?

i dont know ive never astral projected...i've tried and i know it takes a while to be able to do it but im sure if you search on google you can find a website that will tell you.

Some might react differently than others. For me, I don't mind if people try it. I like interacting. But I want to know to expect you at the least. Its sort of like looking through the blinds inside someones window (cough) to spy on them. It is extremely rude and intrusive.

As for being dangerous, I guess that would depend. You are always exposing yourself somewhat by doing something like that. If nothing else, things can be learned about you (and rightly so), if that is a risk to you.

If you are nice about it, I don't see the problem. If you are trying to cause problems, then yes you could get more than you bargained for.

It would be very dangerous to try and enter my dream world "As a spare time I like to add traps and barriors to the land scape there for intruders, its my space and only my space no one else has any buissiness there but me"
I have three dream guides that I know of and many guards of my own design "mostly things I made to inhabit the dream scape I made" but the first spirit guard that was always there is over protective and has told me she has erased an astral form before that tried to intrude "I didn't like this so I make it a point to make these barriors and traps to eject intruders rather tha erase their astral bodies, "this would mean robbing the person of the ability to dream and forever leaving a void in their lives."

basically Astral bodies can be hurt or even destroyed, while this may not "although on rare occurances can" harm the physical body. and never causes death that I have heard of. It still takes away the ability to dream "although I have heard some people have rebuilt their dream bodies over time."

On this subject, Rhuen- Is it possible for an astral body to be trapped somewhere? and how do you free it if this is possible?

I've heard that it is possible for your astral self to become trapped, tho more often than not it's merely because the mind doesn't know it's not a dream and can't understand why the dream won't simply end. More people astral project without even knowing that they are doing it than those who actually try. The only times I have ever done it is with a very close guy that I had once. We were very fond of meeting in dreamland when being together was otherwise not possible.

Yes, If you know your astral projecting than try to make an anchor back to your body that brings you back no matter what. If it can't be freed than you wake up with out remembering the dream and could go long periods of time with out being able to dream or astral project until its released by what ever trapped it. Than in the next dream you'll be able to remember in the dream everything that happened to it while it was trapped "a surreal experienc" its happened to me once before.

Hrmmm... would like to learn more on this subject Rhuen.

Because if what you say is true, then I am, in effect- screwed

Not dreaming? do you think it got stuck somewhere?
There are ways to retrive it, rituals and such "or ways to create a new astral body to use to find the old one and than merge them together "or just have two seperate astral personas."

Would rather not discuss it here. suffice to say that a new body might be easier to obtain that releasing the other one..... although, I would like to discuss it more...

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[SIZE=1][COLOR=yellow]i have always been astrol projecting since childhood,just recently last year come to learn it is true it is real threw books ect...

How to create an astral body "a little visualization meditation exercise"

I should mention that this method is also used to create three other things. Astral Creation: innanimate objects, Astral Beast: part of you but a seperate being and personality. Astral Persona: kind of like Kit from Knight Rider where you control the vessel but another personality is in it as well that can talk to you and try to influence you.

Now the method. Get comfortable, sit down or something. Now you can have your eyes open or closed however its easier for you not to be distracted.

Now focuse in your mind a ball of energy or matter. Now push this ball out into the shape you want "no jumping to new form actually push the ball out like clay into the right shape. When it is the right shape overlap details onto it that you want.
Now you should have an empty shell. The next step determines what its going to be.

If you reach back into the primitive part of your mind and focuse that into the shell while infussing it with your life essence you get an astral beast "keep it attached to your life essence" and as a seperate being it will go into your mind but not merge with you in any way other than that "maybe making a home in you"

Now for an astral body you take the form and pull it to you and will it to be merged over or in your body and mixed with your life essence and mind.

but a persona is a mix of the two where you give the body a personality and merge it with your own.

a warning, the astral beast and persona are not restricted to sleep and meditative states they can and will chime in while your awake and will sound as real to you as any other person and the beast migth actualy be seen by you from time to time. and they might even try to influence your actions from time to time. "basically these two are like making for your self a split personality"

but it doesn't hurt to have back up in the astral plane.

the subject of astral projection facinates me i was wonerding if anyone has done a thread on this

Someone has, the link is posted in the "topics I'd like to see" thread. You can also do a quick search within this section on the word "astral". :)

As for the original question...it is definately possible to have a guardian watching your mind from intrusions. My guardian does, several of my friends, even people I hold ver close, has encountered him when trying to "enter" my mind. Even when I gave them permission to, he would block them from certain areas, things that are very personal to me, I assume.

He's stopped me too, from poking in areas I shouldn't be, as well as prohibiting me from astral projecting at times when I was far from ready to. While I have little control over him, he does guard me in the best way possible. It's like having your very own, reluctantly loyal Kerberos guarding the gates. None shall pass.

I think we all have those, protection from mental attacks, as well as physichal incidents, is what guardians do, after all. Usually they won't barge in physichally and stop you, but rather nudge you to stop yourself. Ever gotten that feeling of "oy...better turn back"? Pay attention to it. Chances are good someone's trying to tell you something.

But who are your guardians? Dead relatives? Spiritbeings? Animals? Angels/demons? Self-created entities? I think the answers are as diverse as we are. A guardian can be either of the options, or something completely different.

What do you think?

Gaurdians have their own motives for protecting you, as I found out the hard way... Never, ever, piss your gaurdian off if its not something you created. Thats all I got to say about that.

I wish you would say more...you got me interested.

If they have alterior motives to watch you, could they still be classified as guardians? Wouldn't it be more like attached spirits?

Clearwitch...

I'm talking more of attached spirits than the typical, "this is my guardian, I created him/her/it as an astral persona/beast."

My gaurdian, or should I say, (and pray) former gaurdian, was something that attached itself to me and served as a gaurdian, mentor, etc. She was, looking back, guiding me more than guarding me. When I gave up magic for a while, it really, really pissed this thing off. I was starting to wonder if I was going to go insane because she wouldn't leave me alone. Finally, I forced her to leave me... for a time.

Her last words haunt me... she said, in a lot more descriptive language, that she would be back for me, and that she didn't appreciate being cast aside just because I wanted to believe in something else.

I had gone from Christianity (of the blind, "sheep" faith) to witchcraft still with that sheep like faith. really stupid, really blind faith that makes for excellent tools and fools. I was good at being both. I finally opened my eyes one day and saw that I had turned my family against me, my friends that still spoke to me were afraid of me, and those that weren't afriad of me.... well, those really weren't my friends. And so I went back to Christianity- with a more open eyed approach. this was two years ago, and as time passes, I am starting to realise that I believe in both magic and Christ. I know I'm probably gonna get a lot of flames for this, but to me, it makes sense. potions are a form of alchemy, which is basically a mystical chemistry. spells and prayers are basically the same. and Ironically enough, while the bible has many verses about witchcraft, if you listen to a very conservative Christian, all religions except Christianity (and jews, "but they just haven't accepted that Jesus was the son of God") are forms of Witchcraft and Satan worshippers. Kinda makes you wonder exactly what the word actually meant. The jews even have Kaballa (sp?) which is a form of magic. Also, I can't sit back and accept the Church's idea that anything supernatural that happens now is the work of Satan. What happened to the spiritual gifts God is supposed to give us? but I digress....

I leave that there to give you an idea of where I am coming from. My "guardian" was something supernatural, and did the duties of a guardian without question... she just had her own motives, what these were, I am not sure. If you want to know more, I could tell you more, but not in a public forum, and not without knowing why you want the information. To Christians, it would seem that I was possessed. To Witches, that I attracted something dangerous to me. All I know, is that she went from an angel to the ultimate bitch in less time than it took for me to make my decision to quit magic two years ago.

Like I said, if it appears that you can piss them off, try not to...and find help.

I've heard stories like that before. A friend of mine has a Ouija horror story, it happened before I met him, so I can't vouch for it, but knowing him, and the way he is, it sounds somewhat plausible to me.

He had three guardians, the nice kind, who's there to help and guide, and make your life as safe and comfortable as possible. And they did take good care of him. He had a fairly good life, good friends, fiancee, job. Not perfect, but then again who does.

But like most in this group of friends, he was interested in the occult. Now I'm no expert in Oujia, I've never been too interested in that particular method myself. But I have heard certain cautionary rule, like never use a Ouija board alone. You alone, unless you're knowledgeable and experience, has a much lesser chance of being able to guard your gate if something bad decides to come through. He did this on his own.

I don't know all the details, but he lit three candles, one for each guardian, before he started. In the middle of this everything went dark, the candles were put out. Something in that darkness must have scared him, he never spoke much of it. But the next morning, he checked the candles, they had been cut over, and there were blood on the wall.

In many ways, a typical Ouija scare story, which is why I'm not totally convinced in and of itself. But the fact can't be denied, that something changed with him. He still has three guardians, or at least three spirits attached to him. But they are not of the good kind. Basically, everything he touches, falls apart. His fiancee had an affair, and he caught them right in the act. He just can't keep a job, even in the rare occations that he gets one, he's severely depressed, but way behind in the health queuye to het any help. He's had one relationship after this, with a girl even more emotionally messed up than him, she left him for her ex.

Basically, he's a broken man. It's been over ten years, and he still hasn't gotten on his feet. Whenever he tries, something pushes him back down. And you really don't want to catch a whiff of his "guardians"...they feel wrong.

Being the sceptic I can sometimes be, I don't really buy into this whole guardian thing. I just think that we don't want to feel alone, we want to feel as if someone or something is looking out for us, at least somebody cares. I don't think anyone would care though. I don't know, maybe I've been watching Fight Club a bit too much.
I've heard quite a bit of these bad experiances with Ouiji boards, some fairly far fetched and seem more like Christian propaganda than actual spook stories. Personnally though, I don't think you should mess around with them, just in case, don't play with fire if you don't want to get burned.

Aside from my creations I have these four "beings" I believe I have written about them before in other threads. They aren't so much guardians as guides, and even do things I would rather they didn't.

Originally it was just three "funny how its often that number that I hear about which is why I am writing this as the above by Clearwitch inspired me to write about this"

I have dubbed them, The Dark Lady, The Dark Man, The Reflection, and the Red Haired Woman.

They all do something different and make very different dreams.

The Dark Lady: works on personality issues and dreams where I have to socialize with people in order to solve a problem "work with the village not just blow it up" is something she actually said to me.

The Dark Man: I call these study dreams, as he is somekind of fedora hat wearing shade that hangs out in a library and hands me books that "tell" me about all sorts of weird things that exist in the dreams.

The Reflection: exists in a mirror in a well underground "The Evening Spring" and talks about Philosophy.

The Red Haired Woman: I have officially declared her as crazy, at first I didn't know who or what this was in my dreams, but I figured out she was raceing me in contests. Contests where figuring out the rules is part of it. These actually are kind of fun as we race and compete in all sorts of weird environments and bizaar cities.

This is just to show that they aren't always there to guard you,but also to challenge you and test you.

So, challenging me and testing me meant making my life a living hell? My "gaurdian" was giving me more reasons to forsake magic than to stay.


And why did this thread get moved?

Maybe you weren't ready? Or maybe your guardian believes in the "tough love" principle.

It could also be your guardian just isn't very good at protecting you...considered asking others?

That's something that should definately be proceeded with caution, but it is possible, depending on your beliefs, to ask for help from the great Spirits, I'm guessing your would be Wolf? My daughter is being watched by Bear, courtesy of a friend of mine, in addition to her regular guardians. This does affect her personality some though, it's like a requested totem, in a way.

And as for why it was moved, it was generally decided that guardians, much like ghosts, are more entities than spells...sorta.

ah. And you reminded me of something I had forgotten, why I could forget I don't know- I did have a spirit wolf that followed me around. a ghost of a wolf if you will. I have no idea what happened to it, it would often quarrel with the other guardian. The wolf only quarreled over moral issues, and often he was on the "higher" ground.

Try calling for it.

I had a spirit cat for a while, I worked in a grocery store while it was most active, and could feel it scramble wildly whenever I got close to the fresh fish counter. I'm not sure if it's still around, and I can't remember its name...but I thought I'd try calling it back.

spirit cat, reminds me of something that I don't consider a guide or guardian so I didn't mention her before. Nyaki, a shadow, soul sucking black cat, more of a side kick than anything else. She hangs around as a small black cat but can assume a humonoid or large panther like form.
She doesn't really guide, or guard, if nothing else she asks me questions and asks for my protection in many a dream "although she would never admit asking for helP"

Strangest thing is I can swear at times she has found her way into this world.
Especially when I get the craving for fish and milk when I don't feel well.
I have pretty much come to think of her as my shadow.

Hey all, Im new here and this is my first post so please forgive me if Im posting this question in the wrong forum.

I would like to know how to find you guide. Also, how do you find out which totem protects you or whatever. Thanks for the help.

Welcome!

You could try here and in the arcane studies forum. You might find what y ou are looking for.

Wow, I like this thread. I have a number of guides/guardians. I am not sure if they have always been with me, but I suspect some of them have been. I have been physically restrained from being run over by a car by them and it was quite strange how it happened. So they are not just guiding me, but guarding or protecting me. I have one guide called White Feather, who I have actually found out is the same guide, exactly to a description and method, that some other people encounter. He was an American Indian chief some time ago, maybe Hopi, don't know. Another guide is called Michael, but I don't know much about him as he is pretty quiet - I know he is youngish though, around the 30 mark. I have recently discovered two new guides - well, new to my awareness at least. One is called Sylfaen and is a Welsh Earth element dragon. The other is called Amergin and was a druid in 1530 BCE - I didn't know about Amergin, just dreamt in a weird language and got the name in a dream. I looked it up and there were plenty of sites with the "Song of Amergin" on them. Didn't know any of it prior to hearing his name in a dream. As for Sylfaen, that name came in a dream too - I didn't know until I looked it up that it was Welsh for "foundation, base or basis - something that you would build upon". Actually, White Feather gave me his name in a dream too. The only one that didn't was Michael - he told me when I was just going about my daily business and I heard a little voice say Michael. So, I definitely believe in guides being real individuals with their own personalities. :1eye: :15:

i know of a number of peole with guardians most have the attached spirit thing going on, they tnd to be more helpful then anyting, though there is one in amongst my frineds whos guaridian has been labled as dangerous but she wone let anyone help her get rid of it dispite the fact that she knows its unsafe

o and Silverwuulf i have seen some small aspect of Christianity once, it was a a few years agoe i had to do some curch youthgroup thing and they had us all sitting in a dark room praying with candels in the middle of the room i was sitting in the corner tryiing not to fall asleep while htey were reading some bible passages or sometihn. Then a candle kinda exploded, it kunda just got brighter and went pop and the glass hoder broke into a few chuncks and the flame went out, alot of the people in the room were what... then another and another i think about 5 diid that it was realy weird. i was trying so hard not to laugh at the reactions of those around me, the candles could have been to blame i suppose but i just find it unlikely that that many some new and some used would all do that within 2 or 3 miin. perhaps thais in an anctdote (sp?) that demonmstrates magic in Christianity in a non-religous ( i dont mean non-relighous but cant think of a better way to say it) way

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forgive any miss spellings its early and i m not really wayke ^_^

Totem
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.

A totem is any natural or supernatural object, being or animal which has personal symbolic meaning to an individual and to whose phenomena and energy one feels closely associated with during one's life.

A simplified dramatic example of this belief in practice is in the Walt Disney Pictures animated film, Brother Bear. In the film, a boy from a proto-Inuit tribe receives a totem of the Bear, which represents Love. Although he initially rejects it, by the end of the story he follows its ideals more literally than anyone ever dreamed possible.

For some tribes, totems can represent larger groups than the individual person, and clans and tribes can have a totem. In kinship and descent, if the apical ancestor of a clan is nonhuman, it is called a totem.

Although the term is of Native American origin, totemistic beliefs are not limited to Native Americans. Similar totemism-like beliefs have been historically found throughout much of the world, including Western Europe, Eastern Europe, Africa, and the Arctic polar region.

In modern times, some individuals, not otherwise involved in the practice of a tribal religion, have chosen to adopt as a personal totem an animal which has some kind of special meaning to them. This practice is prevalent in, but not limited to, the New Age movement. Beliefs regarding totems can vary, from merely adopting one as a whim, to adopting an animal that a person sees representing favorable traits reflected in their own behavior or appearance. A few believe their totem acts as a literal spirit guide. Some Native Americans and other followers of tribal religions take a dim view of New Agers' and others' adoption of totem animals, arguing that a non-adherent cannot truly understand totemism apart from the cultural context, and that at worst, it represents a commercialization of their religious beliefs.

Silverwuulf wrote: "Gaurdians have their own motives for protecting you, as I found out the hard way... Never, ever, piss your gaurdian off if its not something you created. Thats all I got to say about that."

:yikes000: I think I know what you mean about pissing off a guardian or a guide. I was checking something out today that I am obviously not meant to be messing with or am not ready for (not sure which, perhaps the former).

Anyway, I think I caught the attention of something and I think I also upset my guides and/or guardians. I had to do a few things like, say I don't want to get involved in certain activities, then I had to apologise and ask for help from my guides a couple of times.

Thing is, I was warned by them, but I ignored them. It was really obvious too. I had this awful, nauseous, really horrible feeling, but went on anyway. Stupid of me. Anyway, I hope they have cleaned up my mess and I will have to behave myself now as I think they were quite annoyed with me. I really noticed a huge difference when I asked for help and apologised. Prior to that there was such a heavy feeling in the air.

So, as always, tread carefully when summoning anything.

Research.
Research.
Research.
Then, do.