Just wondered really

The greatest genious in philosophy since Arthur Schopenhauer imo. LaVey created the system that represents the purest form of humanism, he gave freedom to the behated children of the false god. Hail LaVey, for what he has given to the society.

Anton LaVey - smuggest smartarse the world has ever seen. I'd have liked to have met him (and given a kidney to hear him play the keyboard) Knew what he was talking about, the philosophy behind his doctrine is one of the sounder I've come across, but he's too easy to misinterpret.

People are all to keen to imitate him to be more 'Satanic'. In part that's a flaw of his books - they deify his own personal peccadilloes and then add a footnote explaining that it's the reader's sins that should be important to the reader. Unfortunately people don't get that far. It's the problem with founding a personality cult, I suppose.

People answer so readly like they knew him. Explaning his flaws and faults.
How do you know that they are flaws? They might have been on purpose.


Why do you think so? Anyone with any sense can see what he is saying. Its only the close-minded people that misinterpret him in quantity.

I dont know what he was like. But I know he has writen the best religion on this earth.

I didn't refer to that as a flaw of his. I'm talking about his books. And if I'm not allowed to comment on an author's writing style... well, I'm wasting my time doing an English degree.

The 'smuggest smartarse' comment is an opinion based on the language he used in interviews - that's all I've got to work with - and he readily admits his spoken and written style is used to present a 'showman-guru' persona, which I've interpreted according to my own opinion of such people. Judgemental, perhaps, but to judge is human...

He's open to misinterpretation because his books sometimes devote more attention to the examples of the philosophical principles than they do to the principles themselves - for example, when he's discussing sex magick LaVey's personal fetishes are presented as the route to power, when the actual point being made is that people need to embrace and treasure their own. A lot of people miss the latter point and assume that they have to desire the things he cites to be truly Satanic.

I'll grant, however, that these people are the sort he wanted to weed out.

Dont take it offencive. Just as 1st thought come. I can see what you mean now though.

I did some reserch for you. You said you would love to listen to Anton LaVeys keyboard skills.


Click Here

Anton LaVey is someone who spoke what most of us felt. I don't think you could call satanism a true religion, more an embracing of humanity for what we are, not something we try to do, but we never will be. Like trying to be like Jesus (except for the whole miracles thing), but Jesus' highest confidant was a hooker (Mary Magdelane) whom he apparently had a sexual relationship with, he also apparently whorshipped the egyptian gods, mainly Isis, so he was a heathen of his own religion. Bit of a hypocrite really.

He spoke what everyone felt indeed... doesn't this remind you of all the "damned" rockstars, that keep talking about how they are the voice of their generation?
LaVey was different imo. The problem with these rockstar-type people is that all of them just keep switching their philosophies in order to fit the times and the changing moods of the ones that listen to their music. LaVey didnt change, he was true till the end.

LaVey was interesting. He had no real concept of religon. Do whatever you want and feel like isn't enough. I only read a little bit out of my friends copy and had lost a copy of the Satanic Bible got from the library, but what I read wasn't that specific or impressive. Seemed like rambling.

rabble rabble rabble...

Oh, thats my Lavey impression. =)

honestly? There are people that paint a much clearer version of "Life, the Universe, and Everything" Like Douglas Adams for instance. =P~

'He had no real concept of religon'

What part exactly did you read? The title?

In my opinion Lavey is the most brilliant philospher when it comes to topics such as these.

abigale, i highly suggest that you read ALL the books that he has written ALL the way through. you might have a different opinion of him than.

It's not my religon. Don't have the time. It's just backwards you know. At first he's like, "There are no Rules." Then he's like, "Here are the rules of the World." Then he's telling men to sleep with any woman that wants him. Blah, blah, blah.

Needs to make up his mind. Are there no rules or is it a manipulative ploy to trick me into doing what he says?

If you read The Satanic Bibile you will see that this isnt true. 'Man needs ritual and dogma'.



And what would your religion be?

I would love to see some one like you create a vast and fathomless religion that awakens people unto their true nature like he did.

There is a select few of us. The Alien Elite. We are elite. That is proven. Those who can openly turn from the philosophies of Satanism must be weak and delusiond. WE embrace humanitys real side.

Man made God. What man has made he can destroy. Those with sense have done so.

Wrong. Im not even going to bother explaning to you what he said.

You said yourself that you havent read his books and that you dont have the time. So how can you claim to know what he says?

What makes you the elite? And why would someone not following your faith be weak? If it's all about self-realisation, wouldn't it prove greater strength of character if someone did this on their own, without following another man's manual?

Its just a way I look at it. We are elite because we embrace humanitys true nature. We dont follow falsehoods. And in a world full of them, we stand out elite.

What I mean by people being weak for turning from Satanism's ways is that they are denying themselves. They are easly missled.

He's a bloody moron, just like the rest of them.

If you feel that you have to spread the truth to others to ensure that people no-longer will be kept in the dark... chances are you're as in the dark as those you hope to enlighten.

BlutEngel, thanks for that link... wish I had sound on this computer, will check it out properly when my laptop arrives.

Aparently you dont know shit about it.
So dont say that if you dont know the truth.

If I "knew the truth" as you so like to put it, I would be so thourilly indoctrinated into the religion that I would not want to say that about it.

When "truth" is relative, no-one speaking against your beliefs can "know" the truth, if they did, they would not be able to speak against your beliefs. Indeed, it is more like christianity than Christianity is.

Yea too right.

We worship God and are against every human instinct known to man.

I also said I skimmed through it quickly. Also stopped at anything listed.

Now who doesn't know what they're talking about? (you, obviously)

Can't even tell the difference between christian and Christian.

Well, perhaps I'll enlighten you, so maybe you will gain a glimpse of something other than your own arse.

christian: Religion based upon controll and non-biblical doctrine

Christian: followers of the biblical teachings of the Christ.

So, Like I said, it is more like christianity than Christianity is.

Come on boys and girls lets all play nice now.

(But I must admit I do agree with BlutEngel on this one)

Bad idea. You will misslead yourself a hell of alot. If you read somthing, do it thoroughly. Ive mad that mistake aswell.



Sorry is it just me? Does any one else know of this amazingly stupid way to define diffrent customs or religions? Spelling somthing without a capital letter and claiming its a diffrent religion or branch of. Well there you go.

1) I care very much about spelling actually and it gets on my nerves when people 'spll lk ths'. These people should be killed in a prolongued and painful way. There I said it.

2) No-one can claim that they are the truth, BlutEngel, by claiming you are the elite and the enlightened, you are no different from those you oppose, and I thought better of you than this.

3)I think LaVey was a clever man, but I wouldn't follow what he says religiously as I broke away from that when I rejected Christianity a few years ago. I think LaVey makes the most sense at this point in time, he speaks his mind, which I admire in a person and is not afraid to admit humanitys failings but also embrace it and accept what we are, stop trying to be something that we are not.

Why so? You and I (and a few others) both talk a damn load more sense than the majority of this lot. Dont you think that some stand out? That some are elite? I might not be perfect but I have commen sense.

Sorry if ive degraded my image in your thoughts but this is the way I am.

To comment on this subject: there is always a group of outstanding individuals, everywhere. If the group is call elite, so be it, it even flatters me in a way. You see, we consider ourselves the elite, because it is obvious, that we can do so, for we worship only ourselves, we are our own gods. As BlutEngel said our thinking makes a lot of more sense than the others'. So I kinda feel obligated to say that we are better than the rest.

Yeah but pretty much anyone could claim they are enlightened in some form or another. It depends on the circumstance, and thanks for the compliment BlutEngel. I just think it sounds egotistical and I'm not too keen on that. But we're all entitled to our own oppinion and by all means have yours. The great thing about oppinion is that most of the time, you can't be wrong. I say most because there are stupid people out there who say that WW2 was propoganda and that it never happened, in which case, they are wrong. But there you go.

For the time being, Fight Club is my bible!

No probs.




I know what your saying but the ego is a nessisity for a good life. Have you actualy read The Satanic Bible? If not, I Highly recomend you do so.



Can people seriously believe that? Never mind that millions of people just 'dissapeard' then...

this book kicks ass.

Okay folks, here's the skinny on LeVey...

The guy was a genius at advertising his image and selling reheated ideas to a generation desperately searching for something other than "religion". Basically, he came along during the perfect moment with the perfect solution to morality.

He had charm, charisma, intelligence, and respect. He knew how to manipulate and bend the opinions of others to suit his own tastes. Don't get me wrong here, I'm not judging or implying that I don't admire the man, just not for the same reasons that most do.

Case in point, who really knows if he even believed half of what he taught. I think allot of what he said he more than likely practiced, but I have to admit that I think allot of it was filler for the masses. He took common sense and turned into a practice anyone could follow.


The Eleven Satanic Rules of the Earth

1. Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked.

2. Do not tell your troubles to others unless you are sure that they want to hear them.

3. When in another's lair, show him respect or else do not go there.

4. If a guest in your lair annoys you, treat him cruelly and without mercy.

5. Do not make sexual advances unless you are given the mating signal.

6. Do not take that which does not belong to you unless it is a burden to the person and he cries out to be relieved.

7. Acknowledge the power of magic if you have used it successfully to obtain your desires. If you deny the power of magic after having called upon it with success, you will lose all you have obtained.

8. Do not complain about anything to which you need not subject yourself.

9. Do not harm little children.

10. Do not kill non-human animals unless attacked or for your food.

11. When walking in open territory, bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not stop, destroy him.

It doesn't really get any easier than that....

I personally have a great respect for Anton because he came when he was needed the most and gave people the chance to take up something that they have been waiting for all their lives. A 'religion' that actually makes sense.

Most of them are commen sense or law anyway. They are just there (or some of them) to show that they dont condone any illigal activites.

Or so I think.

' Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked'

Couldn't live with that. See, there I go again.

Yea thats the one I disagree with... Its natural to do so...

Well, no set of religious rules is going to let you do whatever you were going to anyway (apart from Crowleyanity, anyway, and considering that old Aleister was in a terrible condition when he died I'm not sure if 'do what thou wilt' isn't a synonym for 'wreck yourself, 'cause if you want to live like a normal person you're not good enough for me'). There's got to be some degree of effort involved, otherwise what would be the point?

Why would you need a premade set of rules to follow? Why not just use your own mind, your own common sense...do you really need others to tell you how to live?

Isnt this just the thing people do? Look at the human race of today, look how weak humans are. I think the majority wouldnt even be capable of creating their own philosophy of life. This is the main sickness of mankind, that people cant think on their own an have to get everything laid out for them. So isnt it kinda natural that people try to find a premade philosophy? Theyre just too lazy.

But I think most of open minded people, like we here, at least try to have their own inventions. Even this thread proves that we question everything.

But aren't satanists supposed to be stronger than that? It just seems a bit contradicting to me, on one side you should be strong, self-sufficient, your own master, on the other side you put your life and soul in the hands of another man so willingly...

And now you badmouth mankind in general for doing the exact same thing you yourself does..?

If you are your own God, why would you need to squeeze yourself into another man's label? Why not just be yourself, instead of using the term satanist.

That's a good question.

In my own opinion it defines who we are. I know that this is what Lavey thought when he used the name, but I happen to agree with him. Just because we want to live our own lives following his philosophies doesn't mean that we can't agree with each other.

And, as I have said before, I have a deep respect for him. I don't follow Lavey the person, exactly. I follow his philosophies molded into something that I can adhere to. It doesn't mean that I follow Anton personally. There's a whole lot of difference to following someone personally and following someone's philosophies.

It is this distinction that your post is somewhat lacking Clearwitch.

Which in itself is conforming to the ideaology that conformity is bad, and independence is good. Indeed this is a very commonly spouted line from teens the western-world wide: "we think for ourselves and question everything"

Well, if you truly questioned everything, you would not have time to tell people that you question everything. Indeed, life itself require conformity, and so in essence, there are no non-conformists, or indeed more or lesser conformists, just different ways of conforming.

We all conform in one way or another, we are all sheep waiting to be lead. It's just that some of us believe we are the shepherd

It doesn't make much of a difference though, you're still a follower.

What is it that makes you want to present yourself as a follower of this-and-that instead of just a free thinker, is what I'm getting at, I think. Because it is a concious choice, you yourself decided at some point that you were to face the world as a satanist/lavey-follower, even with modifications. And I just wonder why?

I never called myself a satanist. And doesnt my post say that people like we here try to invent our own stuff?
Anywayz, you are absolutely right abut that we all should have our own life philosophies.

Denied. Shared philosophy creates a sense of community - and as well as being necessary psychologically, it makes life more fun.

The important thing is to question your philosophy, at least enough to modify and defend or even explain it.



In what way, Willow?

I can accept that there's no such thing as a real non-conformist but I think you're taking the concept of 'conformity' a bit further than it needs to go - treating breathing, for instance, as something to be 'conformed' to. Although I suppose any means of finding food is fundamental to a lifestyle, and as soon as you're living a particular way you're 'conforming'... but hopefully we've all chosen to live the way we do, or at least thought about it.

People try too hard to either not conform, and go out of their way to not be part of the crowd, or follow the herd, another sheep to feed the wolf. One thing I hate is the term mini-mosher, it implies there is some sort of competition to see who can listen to the heaviest music. Who gives a fuck if the music you listen to is popular, yes I listen to Linkin Park and Limp Bizkit, Massive Attack, Eminem, Mike and The Mechanics etc but I also listen to Cradle Of Filth, Dimmu Borgir, Arch Enemy etc. Sorry, that was slightly off topic.
If people want to follow Anton LaVeys guidelines, Jesus' guidelines (I can't be bothered to get into a debate about him in this point in time) or the Dhali Llama (sp?). So long as they think for themselves and don't follow them to a point where they no longer form their own oppinion on matters that concern them.

'It doesn't make much of a difference though, you're still a follower.'

No beating about the bush then?

'We are the all singing all dancing crap of the world' :fpope:

I am god. Honestly, and you know this since we talked about it, your posts, and your signature, does send out a general "satanist" vibe. It's easy to misinterpret, my apologies if it offended. :)



I take no prisoners...lol

You do have a point, that the quest of belonging, or not belonging, has a tendency to go way too far these days. The worst has to be the "not-really-belonging-but-kinda-is" people...the ones who happily throws around labels on themself, explains in full detail how others perceive them, only to round it off with firm reassurements that they're really unique and special. Make up your minds, please..?

I still withhold though, that if you are to present yourself as your own God, your own master, it would hold much more weight if you could do so without instantly pointing to the "founding father" of that belief. One thing is to be influenced by outside sources, something else is to put up another's theories as your Bible. See the difference there?

Cards on the table - I know fuck-all about Anton Levay, which probably says quite a lot about him in the first instance.

That being said, you can tell an awful lot about a leader by his followers. Judging by some of the responses here, Levay simply scribbled down a few basic mantras that would appeal to those without direction, and those who feel an unquenchable need to rebel against some perceived oppressor.

The rules that Silver put up there? Well, duh! If I was going to dream up some religion that people would leap at - I'd come up with something similar. The world is full of tuppenny philosophers who pander to the desires of the weak, this guy just seems to be another in that list (Crowley, Manson etc).

All in all - not worth bothering with from what I can make out.

Due to the failures of langauge, I am going to have to remain silent on this one. Other than the saying that logic contridicts itself.

:ol_biggrin: