From what I know, there are two different religions to do with the same name.

1) Where child abuse and animal sacrifice reign supreme, all in name of the fallen God Satan.

2) Where Satan isn't worshipped at all, and one worships onesself, without any child abuse or anything of the like AT ALL!

Now, it's not a case of which one is right, but more of a question as to why there are two different themes.

I previously thought that Satanism was a taboo subject, not to be touched or looked into under any circumstances. Yet, upon finally researching it, I am here with two conflicting views. I've tried talking to people about it, but because of the widespread view that Satanism is evil, I haven't got any info on the subject from a personal perspective. Of course there's plenty of info on the subject on the internet, but no discussion forms about it.

So here one is!!!

So, what does everyone think?

There is only one form of Satanism.

If you had looked into the subject deep enough, you would have seen that the child abusing religion related to Satan is called Devil worship.

Darkangel, you are confused between Laveyan Satanism and chritianitys idea of what satanism is. Or rather, their scapegoat.

There are several subbranches of satanism. LaVeyan, Crowleyan, Temple Of Set,Nine Angels, Odinism...they all fall under the umbrellacategory Satanism. Along with a zillion other, tiny cults. It's like Christianity, catholicism is a branch of christianity, but not all christians are catholics.

There is a thread further down here, covering the basics of the bigger branches.

http://forum.darkness.com/index.php?showto...898&hl=satanism

Thank you ClearWitch for the link, it has been very useful! Much appreciated! :xyxthumbs:

As clear said there are different types of Satanism just as there are different denominations of christianity.

www.fcos.com (copy and paste please) is a site where you can read more in conjuction with www.churchofsatan.com and the thread that clear was kind enough to include in her post.

Do you think maybe you have Sadism and Satanism possibly mixed up? As far as I know, there is only one meaning to Satanism...


--For some reason, I keep wanting to type "Stanism"

All bow before the almighty Stan!
Which as far as I know, means bow to yourself. Bow to expanding yourself as a person. Think for yourself, question authority. Dont take the bible's word for everything...

I agree with the guy whose avatar is a baflima.

Sorry, I'm not a Satanist or Devil worshiper, so I don't know how to spell it.

Baphomet, Said Baf-o-met


And to all those who say there are many types of Satanism, you are wrong. Satanism is 1 specific religion.

Some are related to the Devil but they are not Satanists. The Temple of Set are not Satanists. The Order of the Nine Angels are not Satanists.

Yes like Christianity Satanism may have off shoot groups that use Satanic philosophies but they are not Satanists. They are what ever the religion is.

Why would you think we're talking about sadism? You know, the desire to inflict mental or physichal pain on others...it really has nothing to do with satanism, and it's kind of hard to confuse the two.

What is the one meaning of satanism you're thinking of though?

Then please do explain what you believe satanism to be.

The religion that the Chuch of Satan is based on, that Anton LaVey created with the help of the Order of the Trapezoid.

This might make me seem arogant or ignorant but im just pointing a finger in the right direction.

Believe what you will.

I agree the LaVeyan satanism is a form of satanism. But I don't agree that it is the only form of satanism. I'd very much like to hear what you base your conclusion on?

Satanism has a set way of thinking.

That you are incontrol of your life.
That there is no God/s.
That you should use your animal instincs that were condemnd by the Christian chutch.
That you should stand up and be proud and let no man smite you.

No other religion uses all these qualitys plus the others. And if they do... Why not just call it the real name?

I cant state them all. Read TSB again and you might understand what I mean.

So what matters is what they dubbed themself? What about the ones calling themself satanists after LaVey's church was founded? Or is it first come, first serve? ;)

Ignore that. I read you post wrong and answerd incorrectly... Ive edited it now.

Why is this the only real version of satanism, instead of just one version of satanism?

Isn't that like saying protestants aren't christian because they don't worship God in the same way catholics does?

I have to agree with Clear, as I said before; there are different off branches of Satanism just as most religions have different denominations.

Illuminati, Skulls and Bones, Satanists and Devil worshippers are all different branches of what people to be satanist organizations but they do not all believe the same thing. You can not dismiss one or the other because of the difference in beliefs.

This is very interesting following this conversation...

In my own personal opinion, I think the Church of Satan is the most realistic one of the lot, since most of the others seem to be satanist wannabes that have nothing better to do in their lives then pretend to worship a god that doesn't exist, as far as I'm concerned. Believe me, I've looked at the websites of nearly twenty of these people and they all say the same thing when it comes down to it. That's my own opinion - NO FLAMES PLEASE! It's a free county!

The CoS, however, doesn't preach or anything like that, that I know of. Maybe I'll order Anton Levay's books...

Gotta agree with BlutEngel all the way here.
Satanism is a way of thinking, the ideology created to glorify the benefits of being a human. Humans are the divine, there is no allmighty judge. Celebrate yourself, not some false idols that steal your pure humanity from you.
Satanism is the best way to satisfaction in life. Too bad so many people try to fight it.
Satan is a symbol of going your own way. He sets the mind and body free. What can be better than that? Salvation? More like eternal pity, that you haven't done all the things you wanted to do, but some kinda god told you not to do em.

That really pisses me off!

I've read some of Anton Levay's books: they were just so good I couldn't put them down - he is a great philosopher!

Anyway, I found it almost impossible not to agree with his views. I mean, only someone who has no sense of logic or is extremely stubborn will in a sense be able to 'reject' the powers of Satanism as described in his books. But even than I think they are being extremely stupid, to use that lightly.

I've always found it difficult to dedicate myself to one particular religion. I've tried Christianity dozens of times, and I've also gone as far as Wicca and Vampirism. But none of them seemed right.

This new religion is a definate breath of fresh air for me. It's about time someone thought of it! Way to go Lavey!!!

Well yes they are diffrent versions of christianity. They are almost identical

But there ARE no other versions of Satanism.

Why would you think so? I realy dont understand. You cant call a Devil worshiper even a type of Satanist because he goes against the whole idea of controling your own life.




Quite the same for me. Ive heard of people going from Satanist to Christian... I mean what the hell?

Maybe god talked to them or made a burning bush talk to em instead... well who cares, they are useless now.



It is impossible, so embrace your true nature as it is.
Satanism gives you a choice, nobody tells you to be evil, kill people and do other stupid shit. Satanism is based on your own satisfaction, so you can do whatever you want to be happy, doesnt matter if its "good" or "evil".

The only drawback is eternal hellfire and damnation, lol.
Fucking Christianity. Has to go and ruin everything...

Wow, never thought I'd actually get support over this! Thought loads of Christian do-gooders would come and try to 'save my soul'. Very surprised, intrigued and relieved!

Yes, I do think Christianity does take the fun outta life. Christianity is the human race's biggest problem, including every other religion that doesn't condone the human as animal.

My opinion: Abolish them.

Anyways, that's easier said then done.

I was talking to one of my social peeps about a week ago, and I was reading some of the info on Satanism on the internet when she came up to me and asked me if it was homework for college. Then she started reading it.

Of course I told her what it was about, and then we began a lengthly discussion about what I wanted in life and about how 'God Almighty' wasn't a part of it. She had the balls to say that I was reaching out for something; I was experimenting and wouldn't find God till I was ready.

Fuck off will I.

Then she said that I should throw a challenge to God, so he can prove to me that he exists. And I sat there wondering why one of their rules is that you shouldn't tempt the Lord and yet here she was telling me to do exactly that. What a bunch on hypocrites!

I found the prospect of trying to believe in God a huge waste of time and effort on my part. All I kept thinking was, 'please shut up about God' and then I told her straight that I don't believe in God and that this Satanism was much more logical than anything the Bible says about Jesus and His Father. She said, obviously, 'why?' and all such manner of things designed to convert me when they were actually pissing me off.

Why can't they take the hint and just bugger off?

I do admit though that it does make them better people; they are minding their responsibilities, etc, but it is a complete waste of time.

Does anyone think I should proclaim my Satanic ways? I mean following Lavey's Bible and all that. It wouldn't be preaching I don't think; it would be me telling them what I believe and then I would leave it at that. Is that such a good idea though? Telling my friends and family?

I'm never sure when telling someone means you are preaching or just telling them so they know about it.

Go for it.
If there is one thing I dislike, it is narrow minded people.
People who refer to us as 'Un-patriotic' because we do not follow the leader who has made himself such. People who need someone else to make their decisions for them. People who are too afraid of life to live without their crutch. Go for it.
I'm just afraid of people falling over and hurting themselves when the crutch is removed... call me a softy, lol.

Thanks Wylak! *mwah*

Nah keep em. Who else will wipe the shit off the streets for us?

Its good to see more people that see sense...

We have a bunch of Christians who preach to us at our local haunt. God loves you! Jesus died for you blah blah...
It gets annoying after a while... So we threw eggs at them.

One guy was next to me shouting down his mic (yes they carry speakers and a microphone) 'Jesus loves you, he died for you. How dare you! How dare you say he is a load of rubbish!'

At that I came behind him and shouted down the mic 'HE IS A LOAD OF RUBBISH!'

Had the town in hysterics.

Aww Christians can be so much entertainment.

If Satanism is about letting yourself go free. Why use a religous induced name?

Screw that. I don't think Lavey <sp?> holds the one and only truth. (thanks for the wording Clear) I think there is a little bit of truth in everything.

How can tying yourself down to someone else's belief structure (even if it is about finding your own path or way) be the best path for self development?

I still don't see any justification for LaVey's philosophy being the only acceptable form of satanism...Just the argumentation that it is...because...you say so?

Why do a satanist have to stick strictly to the books written by one single man, and follow his words slavic? Who decided what satanism is, and isn't?

In my opinion, theistic satanists has just as much, if not more, right to use that label on themself, especially since their belief actually involves a satanic figure, not to mention that belief predates 1966 (not excactly old for a religious belief...). I (may) seem stubborn here, but I'm generally sceptic when the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, is being attributed to one specific man.

LaVey did not coin the term "satanism", nor did he invent the religion. He used an already existing term for pure shock value, because he knew the image of being the opposite of the Christian Church would sell. While this is an excellent example of successful advertising, it doesn't make every other use of the word null and void. LaVyan satanism came to be in co-existance with other directions of the religion, not instead of it. To think otherwise is just ignorant and elitist, in my opinion.

And the traditional satanists not blindly toddling after the writings of mr LaVey...why excactly aren't they satanists? If the primary idea is the belief that you are the power, am I a satanist?

Some time ago a friend told me a story about a guy I knew in the past. The dude was a declared satanist and a true one. This guy went his own path, and I lost contact with him. And now my friend told me that the guy became a catholic priest. I mean, what the fuck??
The guy says that something very important happened in his life and that he understood that "his way of life is the way of god" or some bullshit like that. So now I wonder, is this guy insane, or did he just lost the balls.

EDIT: LaVey's satanism is the only true one. Hail the Black Pope!

Nuthin but <3 for you here Clear.

You too, messiah.



Is it any better to say "my way of life is LaVey's way"..? You're both setting your beliefs and your way of life up after another man's word, seemingly without even questioning it...

A lot of people switch beliefs. They go from christian to satanist, from buddhist to muslim, it means nothing more than the fact that they rethought their life philosophy, and decided the path they were on were wrong for them. And honestly, who's to say which way is the right way?

Dunno about BlutEngel, but I added some things to the basic satanism theory created by Anton LaVey. It's not that I blindly follow his words without questioning anything, that's the catholic way, which is bad. I try to adjust the philosophy of satanism to my everyday life, so that I can celebrate myself and my individuality. I add my own thing, kinda personalizing stanism so that it fits my needs and expectations. I do question the words of LaVey. But after thinking about it, and just looking for proof in life, I honestly gotta say, that none of his words were misleading in any way. It's all too pure (satanism) imo.

EDIT

Everyone has to make a choice on his own. I made mine.

A few questions I have about Satanism, because I'm not sure whether the Satanic Bible explains this/these.
+Why is it called Satanism if you are not whorshipping Satan?

+What do Satanists believe happens when they die, because I agree completely with what LaVey has said in his books, because I held these views before I read it. But if they don't believe anything happens when they die why is it called a religion? Surely that just makes it a bible for atheism? Or just a way of life, even though religion is a way of life, isn't it really about choosing what you think happens to you when you die?

+Why do Satanists say they do not whorship Satan, or whorship any Gods, but when they do magick workings call upon deitys or gods/goddesses to assist them in their magickal working? Surely this is a contradiction?

I would be glad if anyone could answer these questions.

The LaVeyan satanism is called the true form of Satanism because it was the first officially named Satanist religion. There were things before this, but they weren't actually satanic, in fact they were more just people rebelling against christianity using magick based around christian teachings. All modern forms of Satanism now are based on or came after LaVeyan Satanism.

+Satan is a symbol of the opposite way to god's. It's called satanism because satanists acknowlegde their humanity and that humans are animals, and Satan represents these values, as well as self-improvement, pride, etc.

+It's not a religion, it's a philosophy of life. And who cares what happens after death, you got this life, and this life only, satanism stands for using that life with no boundries. Carpe diem (or carpe noctem, as some would say :P )

That was kind of my interpretation of it all with the not worshiping gods but practicing magik. Hear there are worse than Satanists really. People who prey on others to sacrifice them to demigods and trap them in the demon realm that is supposed to be on the other side of mirrors. Really pretty sure they worship Satan too. Then there is the group where they simply believe God and the Devil are the same. They worship God but since they believe God is the Devil too, are much more relaxed about biblical laws and what not.

It is funny though because often Christians, Jews, Catholics and all the like with their pronounced religious influence lump any religion acknowledging the paranormal as Satanism. Gypsies or whomever. So as usual, same words, different meaning depending on who says them.

Sorry, did that kill everyone's fun. You know Jewish people see that everything supernatural is actually God performing for people to reinforce the ideas of following God's law. This is slightly different from Devil worship.

Also another thing became aware of talking to one Satanist, but not really several in a group, is the idea they were born to act upon others in vengence. You see the idea was really wholistic yet twisted. Something about how people go through life doing evil to everyone; their children, friends, family and misc. They don't worship God because God never protected them. Then they decided that God made them who they are to protect victims of evil and sinners.



It's an idea. In their actions they end up fairly the same.

No I use LaVeys philosphies in my life along with my own... It just happens that I use almost all of his.




If you realy want to know the answers to all that you have in your head. Get The Satanic Bible. I had all these same questions in my head when I found Satanism but just reading that one book answerd it all...




Yup.




It would apear your refering to us?

HA HA!






Who the fuck have you been talking to?




He dont protect you either.


Daemon Necromorbus has answerd alot of the questions I was going to answer. And fair play, He has sense.

Vengeance is the divine pleasure, don't you know? There is nothing more stupid than that christian thing to turn the other cheek or something like that. You know, vengeance kinda makes you god, cause he is the one that has no mercy, he is the one to torture mankind for one single fucking sin. I feel pity for those who dont take what belongs to them. By turning the other cheek you show your weakness. And the main rule is: stronger than all.
Furthermore, this is not just a matter of your ideology or religion. It's a matter of honor. It's a great shame for a man if he doesnt avenge himself. Revenge gives peace to the soul of a man. So why shall I lose respect for myfelf by not having revenge on those who deserve it? It's plinly stupid, and stupidity is the only sin.

Yea.

Jesus said - Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

Satanist/Person with sense says - Do unto others as they do unto you.

If you treat others how you want to be treated that places you at their mercy. Sorry but I dont think so mate. I bow to no one!

Anton LaVey said - If a man smite thee in one cheek, SMASH him in the other.

Strike them 10 fold, 100 fold, 1000 fold! and make yourself known to your adversery. Make him think twice about confronting you next time.

Exactly.

So this is the end of the thread I say?

Not quite...I'm still not convinced why LaVey's philosophy is the only one worthy of using the name satanism...so far the only reason I can see I've gotten is "because it is"...

it's called "satanism" for the sole purpose that they try to aim for the exact opposite of Christian morality.

Technically, it has nothing to do with "satan" and does not deserve the title.

And you would know that how?

You know very little about it. That is obvious. There are reasons. How about you educate yourself before posting next time...

Not like its going to happen...

Isn't it a sin in christianity to question the words of god? Why can't you people understand?
Satan = evil. Following the path of the left hand = evil according to christians. Evil is represented by Satan in christianity. What can be more simple? What part of it dont you understand? It's called Satanism to show that it stands for things that are considered evil by christians. The name is justified. LaVey called it that way, and this should me but enough for a reason. By saying it's not is like you said that I have no right to call my son Satan, Lucipher, or whatever. Do you understand these things that I'm saying????

How about you educate us instead? Why is it called satanism, if it has nothing to do with Satan?

Yes. It's basically the same thing Willow said...where's the problem..?

And...it still doesn't explain why the non-laveyan branches are not to be dubbed satanism, even if they actually do have a satanic figure in their denomination.

Cause the name is already taken by the laveyan branch, as you called it. When I first wanted to register to this board I wanted to use my standard nick which is Daemon. The name was already taken, so I had to modify it. I didn't ask you guys why is the name taken, because its very simple. Same with Satanism.